Interactive Forum November 2021: Daniil Medvedev Forehand

[doctorhl]

Why does that pic make my shoulder hurt?...If I incorrectly sequenced forward from that position as a potential Medvedev wannabe......trouble. But I would gladly take any of his wins!!

[jeffreycounts]

That lag is significant in that still pic, no doubt. It JY's video of his forehand, which started this thread, he does not seem to me to have that same lag.

I grabbed that from the video that started the thread (it's the last one in the sequence). The lag really stands out if you are looking straight on, or from behind. Much harder to see from the side.

I'll also add that it's not just lag of the wrist. From Brian Gordon, there is external rotation of the shoulder here as well.

[stroke]

I agree with you and think your description is spot on. Here is a still frame that I think really shows the lag he creates

Screen Shot 2021-11-28 at 10.34.45 PM.png

That lag is significant in that still pic, no doubt. It JY's video of his forehand, which started this thread, he does not seem to me to have that same lag.

[ejkantor]

Great picture Capture

[jeffreycounts]

Well, its been a VERY long time since I've interacted here. Everything everyone has written so far is on point. One thing not talked about that I see is the massive lag in the wrist followed by the wrist snap forward ever so quickly before contact. Looks to me like a lot energy, power, spin, all of the above happens in a thousands of a second when he sort of throws the racket head into the ball. Maybe this why he's able to generate the power and the spin without the longer follow throughs all us mortals have to do. Just a thought.

I agree with you and think your description is spot on. Here is a still frame that I think really shows the lag he creates

Screen Shot 2021-11-28 at 10.34.45 PM.png

[doctorhl]

Great description. Part of the description reminds me of years ago when shotput technique transitioned from linear movement across the ring to rotational movement around the ring.

[jschaff]

Incredibly consistent stroke motion. He starts with the longest possible moment arm with excessive extension back behind him. Then his body rotation gets the racket moving and he progressively shortens the moment arm to and thru contact. The wrap around his neck on the follow thru is where the shortest moment arm occurs. This is the equivalent of a skater spinning with arms out to start and pulls them in to speed up the rotational velocity. Same thing. And that movement keeps the racket head stable thru the contact zone. It is a great shot. Comparatively flat for a top level pro. I am excited that Daniil is bringing back flat shots. It is gonna expand the game a lot.

[arturohernandez]

Medvedev is a unique case. His aesthetics aren't as appealing as Federer or Dimitrov, his left arm stretch is not full or complete, his backswing is larger than normal, his extension shorter than normal...but the tennis ball doesnt know this. He has 1 grand slam title more than all of us combined and is #2 in the world. As long as he knows how to hit it, I think he's doing just fine. The moment of truth in strokes is his contact point. As John mentions it is appropriate for his grip structure.

One thing I find interesting is his exceptional timing and focus on the ball. Notice his head position at contact and after the ball has left his strings and he has begun the extension. His head is still down watching the contact. If the rest of his stroke may be lacking appeal, this part seems to be a nice model for others to emulate.

Important to separate the style from the fundamentals. Medvedev moves like a gazelle, has elasticity beyond what seems human and has a very high tennis IQ. Provide any player these three things and I'm sure they will figure out the rest as they see fit.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA, PTR
Delray Beach
SETS Consulting
http://www.setsconsult.org

I was reading about the mystery of his forehand and how everyone had questions about it.

So, I showed it to my son and daughter. My daughter did not like aesthetically. She seemed to think it was not pretty.

My son said he did not think it was a stroke you should teach. But he thought it worked for him and most importantly he used his energy well. He felt that Medvedev was putting energy through the ball. Not ideal technique but it was good use of energy.

[jimlosaltos]

Medvedev is a unique case. His aesthetics aren't as appealing as Federer or Dimitrov, his left arm stretch is not full or complete, his backswing is larger than normal, his extension shorter than normal...but the tennis ball doesnt know this. He has 1 grand slam title more than all of us combined and is #2 in the world. As long as he knows how to hit it, I think he's doing just fine. The moment of truth in strokes is his contact point. As John mentions it is appropriate for his grip structure.

One thing I find interesting is his exceptional timing and focus on the ball. Notice his head position at contact and after the ball has left his strings and he has begun the extension. His head is still down watching the contact. If the rest of his stroke may be lacking appeal, this part seems to be a nice model for others to emulate.

Important to separate the style from the fundamentals. Medvedev moves like a gazelle, has elasticity beyond what seems human and has a very high tennis IQ. Provide any player these three things and I'm sure they will figure out the rest as they see fit.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA, PTR
Delray Beach
SETS Consulting
http://www.setsconsult.org

So, Flash plus Gumby plus Brainiac.
Quite the combo of super hero skills
But apt.

[stroke]

Stroke, my post really has nothing to do with whether or not his spin rates are high or low. The post is just my take on how he can generate spin and/or pace with such a short arm extension unlike most pros. In my opinion if you look very closely at the videos there is a moment where he accelerates his wrist forward that allows him to create whatever he's looking for. He can hit nasty spin or nasty pace.....maybe not spin like Rafa, but he can create anything he wants.....he's kinda good!

No doubt he is good, probably #1 very soon. I guess I just misinterpreted what you are saying. No problem at all.

[ejkantor]

Stroke, my post really has nothing to do with whether or not his spin rates are high or low. The post is just my take on how he can generate spin and/or pace with such a short arm extension unlike most pros. In my opinion if you look very closely at the videos there is a moment where he accelerates his wrist forward that allows him to create whatever he's looking for. He can hit nasty spin or nasty pace.....maybe not spin like Rafa, but he can create anything he wants.....he's kinda good!

[stroke]

Well, its been a VERY long time since I've interacted here. Everything everyone has written so far is on point. One thing not talked about that I see is the massive lag in the wrist followed by the wrist snap forward ever so quickly before contact. Looks to me like a lot energy, power, spin, all of the above happens in a thousands of a second when he sort of throws the racket head into the ball. Maybe this why he's able to generate the power and the spin without the longer follow throughs all us mortals have to do. Just a thought.

His spin rates on the forehand per ATP shotspot data is anywhere from 600-1200 rpm's less than almost all other ATP male players.

[ejkantor]

Well, its been a VERY long time since I've interacted here. Everything everyone has written so far is on point. One thing not talked about that I see is the massive lag in the wrist followed by the wrist snap forward ever so quickly before contact. Looks to me like a lot energy, power, spin, all of the above happens in a thousands of a second when he sort of throws the racket head into the ball. Maybe this why he's able to generate the power and the spin without the longer follow throughs all us mortals have to do. Just a thought.

[tobinlim]

His high take-back reminds me of a Delpo melded with a WTA-style forehand. I think he hits real loose and generates a lot of racquet head speed that results in his hitting arm consistently wrapping around his left shoulder. His style is unique but not necessarily "unattractive" IMO. The man is destined to be Djokovic 2.0.

[stotty]

Medvedev is a unique case. His aesthetics aren't as appealing as Federer or Dimitrov, his left arm stretch is not full or complete, his backswing is larger than normal, his extension shorter than normal...but the tennis ball doesnt know this. He has 1 grand slam title more than all of us combined and is #2 in the world. As long as he knows how to hit it, I think he's doing just fine. The moment of truth in strokes is his contact point. As John mentions it is appropriate for his grip structure.

One thing I find interesting is his exceptional timing and focus on the ball. Notice his head position at contact and after the ball has left his strings and he has begun the extension. His head is still down watching the contact. If the rest of his stroke may be lacking appeal, this part seems to be a nice model for others to emulate.

Important to separate the style from the fundamentals. Medvedev moves like a gazelle, has elasticity beyond what seems human and has a very high tennis IQ. Provide any player these three things and I'm sure they will figure out the rest as they see fit.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA, PTR
Delray Beach
SETS Consulting
http://www.setsconsult.org

A very accurate analysis and summary. Just when the technicians think they've nailed the optimum way to play, along comes an anomaly to put the spanner in the works.