Andy Murray and the Open Stance Forehand

[10splayer]

I initially opened a thread for this comment but just now saw that you guys have already been discussing the Murray forehand so I am just copying it in here:

Hey John,

Really enjoyed your article on the Andy Murray forehand and the possible implications of the stances.

I definitely agree with you on the analysis that Murray does not make full use of the hip and shoulder turn and that he hits too much open stance. Nevertheless, I think another factor could be very important when we talk about the question why his forehand is not as fast and heavy on average as those of the other 3 top guys.

Andy does not get nearly the amount of lag or pre-stretch as some people call it with his wrist on average compared to the other top guys.

Attached are a few screenshots from your high speed archive. I couldn't figure out how to directly put them into the post. Of course these are just two shots but I looked at a lot of his forehands and on average he does not get nearly the angle between wrist and forearm that Fed, Nadal, and Djokovic get.

In order to maximize your racket head speed you obviously need to maximize the amount of energy created in all aspects of your stroke. I guess the difficult question now is what factor contributes how much to the lack of speed and spin in Murray's forehand. Is X-Factor/hip and shoulder rotation more of a factor or is it the amount of lag between wrist and forearm ? Tough to say obviously but my guess is that the lag effect contributes a little more.

The two reasons I believe that:
#1: experimenting with my own forehand and my students
#2: I've spend quite a bit of time studying the mechanics of the golf swing with my friend Oliver Heuler who is regarded as the leading golf instructor in Germany. He told me that in Golf the lag effect contributes quite a bit more towards racket head speed than X-Factor and is by far the number 1 aspect to look at when someone lacks distance with their golf swings.

Obviously there are differences between Golf and Tennis and answering this question is quite difficult but I am sure there is somebody out there with the equipment to exactly measure these contributions. Brian Gordon maybe ?

What are your thoughts ?

Regards,

Florian Meier

Yup, a picture is worth a thousand words. It's pretty obvious how much more "load" is placed on the forearm in the Fed and Nadal photos. Much more potential racquet head speed and wiper action with these angles, regardless of stance permutation.

The amazing thing, is that Fed achieves these angles with an easternish grip. Conservative grip with the wiping potential of an extreme one. IMO, it's one of the main reasons it's the single greatest stroke I've seen in my lifetime.

[stotty]

IMO, it's one of the main reasons it's the single greatest stroke I've seen in my lifetime.

My thoughts exactly. I agree entirely.

[tennisman1]

Andy Murray Forehand

John, You are amazing,outspoken and so perceptive. I just finished reading the article on Andy Murrays forehand. My first thoughts went back to when you analyzed Andy Roddicks backhand. It takes a lot of confidence in your analytical ability to critique a pros stroke. You boldly forged ahead! Right on the money with your analysis again.
Next I thought about how it definitely applied to my game and how I can improve my shots which are always a work in progres..
Thanks Again for being out there and outfront with Tennisplayer.

[John Yandell]

Appreciate it T Man