Tour Strokes: Maria Sharapova Serve

[bottle]

Thanks

Let me pre-apologize that 1) this is off topic from Sharapova (but it is about serving) and 2) I readily admit to getting overly amped about new phenoms after only one match, so please excuse my enthusiasm. {If I'm violating unwritten forum rules, let me know.}

But, have any of you seen Naomi Osaka's serve and what do you think of her technique? FYI: This 16-year-old won her first-ever WTA tour-level event by (ready?) out-serving Sam Stosur, #19 in the world yesterday. Awesome, 3 set almost-three-hour match.

Osaka was bombing 116 mph regularly, max 120 mph then just when I (and perhaps Stosur) thought she was a one-trick pony, and she had Stosur backed up, Osaka started hitting slow, wide slice that took Stosur out to the side wall -- including a second-serve ace at 91 mph short in the box and wide. Aside from her serve, Osaka is fast and she came from behind in a tie break and from 3-5 in the final set, against a veteran.

Style: Step up, arms up-together ala Monfils. Barely bends her knees yet somehow gets enough push to jump a foot into the air. Sudden racket head acceleration. One of my photos of her:

Osaka first round 13 by james.fawcette, on Flickr

Thank you for this fascinating post.

[10splayer]

Interesting! I think it also is a key to a balanced landing and keeping enough weight behind so the torso jackknifes less. In any case if you are going to leave the court you need to kick back...

Yup, I was actually experimenting with this on the court yesterday. When I didn't keep my trail leg behind the lead, (kick back) just landing upright was enough of a challenge, forget serving well...

[John Yandell]

Interesting! I think it also is a key to a balanced landing and keeping enough weight behind so the torso jackknifes less. In any case if you are going to leave the court you need to kick back...

[10splayer]

I still question whether the omnipresent kickback is an adaptation for balance and not going forward to the net, as Geoff suggests in the last post, or is it really a mechanism that adds additional speed to the serve. There is some reasoning I can see in the idea that if the server creates additional momentum to the rear, that momentum can in some way be balanced by additional momentum that was transferred to the ball going forward. Or something like that. Biomechanists, help!

don

I would suspect that the "kickback" is a counter measure to ensure the hips don't over rotate. In the video i've seen, this move, coincides with the reduction of hip rotation...On the surface, this would make sense from a kinetic chain principle, as it would transfer energy to the torso in a more efficient way. After all, over rotation is an angular momentum killer..

It would also make sense (at least to me) that it would be much more prevalent in modern day players who are allowed to leave the ground. Because once in the air, no external force can act on rotation to the positive or negative....So the kickback begins as they push against the ground...Before the rule change, i would imagine that controlling hip rotation was "doable" because they were still engaged to the ground...

[jimlosaltos]

Naomi Osaka and pre-apologies

Let me pre-apologize that 1) this is off topic from Sharapova (but it is about serving) and 2) I readily admit to getting overly amped about new phenoms after only one match, so please excuse my enthusiasm. {If I'm violating unwritten forum rules, let me know.}

But, have any of you seen Naomi Osaka's serve and what do you think of her technique? FYI: This 16-year-old won her first-ever WTA tour-level event by (ready?) out-serving Sam Stosur, #19 in the world yesterday. Awesome, 3 set almost-three-hour match.

Osaka was bombing 116 mph regularly, max 120 mph then just when I (and perhaps Stosur) thought she was a one-trick pony, and she had Stosur backed up, Osaka started hitting slow, wide slice that took Stosur out to the side wall -- including a second-serve ace at 91 mph short in the box and wide. Aside from her serve, Osaka is fast and she came from behind in a tie break and from 3-5 in the final set, against a veteran.

Style: Step up, arms up-together ala Monfils. Barely bends her knees yet somehow gets enough push to jump a foot into the air. Sudden racket head acceleration. One of my photos of her:

Osaka first round 13 by james.fawcette, on Flickr

[klacr]

Serving problems are rhythm problems. Height toss is a huge issue.

Remember that "Kaizen" effect that Doug Eng spoke about in an tennisplayer.net article?

http://www.tennisplayer.net/members/...ervice_rhythm/

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

[jimlosaltos]

Impact Point, Pic of Maria's serve

... I think her shoulder issues could be caused by her hitting arm getting past the plane of her shoulders as she hits her serve. In other words, the angle between her upper arm and body gets well past 90 degrees, putting her hitting shoulder under stress.

Here's a photo captured right at impact {also from one of my "Tour Portraits" for this site, per your comment:

Sharapova_4JohnY_©jfawcette 2969 by james.fawcette, on Flickr

[GeoffWilliams]

She looks like a daddy long legged spider that can scream a lot.

[stroke]

Great discussion here on Maria's serve from bobbyswift and JY. Very interesting what Robert L thinks caused Maria's shoulder issues. It is clear to me she does not get to a comfortable contact point, or extension point on her forehands, which one would have to think would cause some physical discomfort. I would guess though her forehand would reveal physical discomfort more in the forearm/golfers type elbow than the shoulder. As Brian Gordon has expressed, one has to get in a pretty straight arm hitting configuration to really take advantage of the shoulder as a driving force on the forehand. I think her shoulder issues could be caused by her hitting arm getting past the plane of her shoulders as she hits her serve. In other words, the angle between her upper arm and body gets well past 90 degrees, putting her hitting shoulder under stress.

[hockeyscout]

For what it's worth Robert L. thinks the shoulder injury was caused by her late forehand contact over years.

Very very very very interesting.

[gzhpcu]

As Rod Cross points out, the high toss results in the ball dropping faster at impact causing more topspin to be applied to the serve. With the lower toss, you have less of a hitch in your movement.

[John Yandell]

Yeah good point. I don't disagree it could and should come down. You know yourself from working with high level players (the guilty will remain unnamed...) that things that radically change the feel are often very difficult to sell even as an "experiment." I bet Sven has felt that and is certainly too smart to push the river where it doesn't want to flow. Yet...

And I had forgotten about Kiefer! That was the record.

[bobbyswift]

Maria

The beauty of coaching. I would try to implement my plan first. As an hour develops I would shift to your plan and see what each does for her body. In my opinion she needs both but either might really change result. If you get a chance and are so inclined look at her toss height versus any great server. You will be stunned. I have Keifer serving at UCLA back in the day and their is a palm tree to judge height of toss and how much ball is dropping. her toss is the exact height. Her leg drive is great her contact pt. is good.

[John Yandell]

Interesting. I think the lower toss height all things being equal is preferable. But a 4 foot change would be tough to impossible since it sets the interval and the rhythm. But I think the equal weight distrib at a later point does seem potentially a real possibility.

I still think all else aside when you have that much (accidental? mentally restricted?) variation in the rotation in the upward swing, consistency is gonna be impossible. It's only my opinion but I think this would be the first focus point. Especially because you are asking her to do something she actually already does on many balls.

For what it's worth Robert L. thinks the shoulder injury was caused by her late forehand contact over years.

[bobbyswift]

maria serve

Correcting her serve would start with a four foot toss height reduction. Her next correction would be keep back foot flat until ball release. Her backswing would adjust probably naturally. I would then have her adjust from Pete as her trophy position to Federer. Whatever position of separation angle of hip and shoulder she trys to achieve she must reach that position at a earlier time.