Muscle memory

[don_budge]

A Couple of Things...ferli001

Your posts are inspiring me to draw upon how I felt the golf swing and its tempo and the confidence I had in letting the momentum build. I have tended to compartmentalize the two sports rather than move between them --partly because they are so different and yet so alike. hey, you got me thinking. Oh and by the way, I chose my ferli001 name not thinking about posting or gender. I am "she" Cheers

Thanks ferli001. I have been known in certain circles to be an inspirational teacher. Certain limited circles. I have spent a good deal of thought in blending the two activities. As different as they are. One might say that golf has certain elements of the infinite whereas tennis might tend to be defined by the finite. No two golf courses in the world are the same and you can play the same golf course a million times and you will never play it the same way twice. The tennis court on the other hand is the same anywhere in the world. From an airplane they all look alike. Same size...those magical metaphysical lines. What a great invention.

I chose my user_name in a funny roundabout way. I was searching the web for a video of the Don Budge backhand and I landed in tennisplayer.net. I had known Don Budge for a couple of summers when I was young (1972 and 1973) so when I joined I signed up as don_budge...never knowing there was a forum here that I would spend a significant amount of time writing about tennis under the name don_budge. Among other things.

A true "growth" mindset! this is when tennis (or golf) becomes something more than just a game --its an attitude, a way of thinking about life. At least, it is for me.

For sure: the video is the analyst in the relationship between one's serve, one's desire, and stubborn old muscle memory. But darn it, we will get there!
cheers

When you are all in it certainly becomes something more than just a game. I have heard some say that it becomes an obsession but I prefer to think of it as a fascination. Obsession doesn't sound nearly as healthy. But certainly if you pursue either to become the best that you can be in the hunt for the perfect you it is at the very least a way of life. I think that the two activities are God's gift to humanity in terms of recreation. What else challenges you on all aspects of your being. Intellectual, physical, emotion and even spiritual? It almost becomes religion. Both games have a tremendous amount of ritual when you start to get deep.

For sure these activities become exercises of a physical endeavour, psychological analysis, philosophical questions and even trying to reach a higher spiritual plane. It's a science. Yet at the same time it is purely metaphysical in nature. Nothing exact. No road maps. Just start hacking your way through the brush. Well, not exactly. More like a Sherlock Holmes hot on the trail of a search for what pleases you.

Pardon me as I am lost in thought as of late. Existential experiences abound. Thank you ferli001 "for making me think".

ahhh "prof" Don_budge, your insights crack me up! Yes you are right, my approach is a legacy of my golfing mind and I had not realized it. Ok, so I loved spending hours on the range, working on targets and shots. I loved the time alone, and the time on the course where I would find a green on the back nine and chip and putt til sunset or clear away a patch of snow to work on my chipping in the dead of winter. Indeed, I struggled at first when I started playing tennis with this lack of alone concentrated time. You know what I mean? And then I discovered a wall in my gym!!! I love the wall. Now, I also love to hit with partners and league --so its not like I am anti-social or anything. Now, I wonder, whether high achieving golfers are more technique oriented than tennis players? is there more variety in tennis swings than there is in golf swings? Probably?

I don't want however to walk this thread away from its original topic... but this is all fascinating to me.
So, anyway, when I changed my golf grip, I grooved it on the range first. This is how I was thinking of doing with my serve. But you suggest not.... hmm. I can see the value of integrating practice sets. Give that a try. 15 minutes on court plus working in front of mirrors at the gym.

I do know what you mean. Trust me I do. There were moments in each sport when I reached a certain level of perfection. If only for a moment or two. But it's all personal...we are all different. You certainly have the mindset. The tools. To create your game. The wall. You cannot beat it and it will never quit on you. Most get bored with it. But this is where that golfer mentality that you talk about pays off. Both sports require an infinite combination of patience (stubbornness) and passion. For the love of the game.

Don't ever think twice about changing directions in mid thread. These are the most interesting and thought provoking...I think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Om5uhnjksVI

So let me ask you this ferli001...what exactly did you change your grip from and then to? I was watching this Seve Ballesteros video and he talks about the grip about two or three minutes into it. His left hand is "weaker" than I have been using and the change "feels" profound. I don't need a video camera to verify how it feels. I am just itching to get to the range to experiment with it.

Yeah...balance. Did I mention that I say that golf is a game of energy and balance and that tennis is golf on the run? Tell me about the grip. Thanks.

If only it were so simple as to say "muscle memory". But then again...that wouldn't be any fun.

[gzhpcu]

Thought I had made progress, yet video says no.... back to the old drawing board....

[ferli001]

Awesome! And impressive fitness. I am trying to improve balance because in addition to the serve I want to ... learn some footwork ...thanks to our site's videos... so balance now is important to me with all the hops and stuff. I know its overly ambitious but what the heck...although I think I will settle for a few of the golden moves only.
Off to hit, yay.

[gzhpcu]

Yes, I know I am probably a bit nuts...

[gzhpcu]

Hi Phil --"stubborn" is the athletic mindset! Never give up. I will check out the Compex apparatus -- do you work on balance and flexibility as well?

Yes, I do a stretching routine, about 20 minutes. Have not tried balance. I do 40 pushuos in a row, 300 ab curls, work out with two 7 lb weights, stationary cycling. Daily, no excuse to skip a day. Plus every other day use fascia roller for my knees. Use Compex for my quads primarily, 25 minutes daily.

[ferli001]

I also compliment physical exercises with electrical muscle stimulation. I have been using a Compex apparatus now for three months. Find it great in addition to the other actual exercises.

Hi Phil --"stubborn" is the athletic mindset! Never give up. I will check out the Compex apparatus -- do you work on balance and flexibility as well?

[gzhpcu]

I also compliment physical exercises with electrical muscle stimulation. I have been using a Compex apparatus now for three months. Find it great in addition to the other actual exercises.

[ferli001]

[QUOTE=don_budge;n72398]From the Range, to Practicing on the Course, to Playing on the Course...to the End Game. Competition.

Ahhh...typical golfer. The golfer has to learn how much time to spend on the range and then to take it to the court. Face the devil so to speak. So ferli001 I recommend the daily regime that I didn't necessarily prescribe for Phil above. For you, depending upon other factors, fifteen minutes a day is plenty of time to practice the serve and then spend much of your time actually playing practice sets. Some drilling and some "hitting a few" with practice parters as well. HIT AGAINST THE WALL!!!

ahhh "prof" Don_budge, your insights crack me up! Yes you are right, my approach is a legacy of my golfing mind and I had not realized it. Ok, so I loved spending hours on the range, working on targets and shots. I loved the time alone, and the time on the course where I would find a green on the back nine and chip and putt til sunset or clear away a patch of snow to work on my chipping in the dead of winter. Indeed, I struggled at first when I started playing tennis with this lack of alone concentrated time. You know what I mean? And then I discovered a wall in my gym!!! I love the wall. Now, I also love to hit with partners and league --so its not like I am anti-social or anything. Now, I wonder, whether high achieving golfers are more technique oriented than tennis players? is there more variety in tennis swings than there is in golf swings? Probably?

I don't want however to walk this thread away from its original topic... but this is all fascinating to me.
So, anyway, when I changed my golf grip, I grooved it on the range first. This is how I was thinking of doing with my serve. But you suggest not.... hmm. I can see the value of integrating practice sets. Give that a try. 15 minutes on court plus working in front of mirrors at the gym.

I also am a BIG believer in "prehabilitation" and so I alternate days on the court with days at the gym to strengthen myself. Looking at diet too -- now, is that a golfer's mindset... ? just kidding.

cheers!

[don_budge]

Thanks again. Telling me to be careful does not hurt. I hope my working with weights and pushups keeps my shoulders strong.

Absolutely it does. I call it "prehabilitation". Another word that I made up. It isn't in my spell check or the dictionary. But that is absolutely a huge advantage that you do yourself with that kind of work. Preventing injury is certainly better than rehabbing. Perhaps I should have been an English professor.

But keep up your good work. Take what I say with a grain of salt. Soldier on!

It is a rollercoaster...based on the gravitational pull of the earth on the head of the racquet.

[gzhpcu]

Thanks again. Telling me to be careful does not hurt. I hope my working with weights and pushups keeps my shoulders strong.

[don_budge]

Thanks don_budge. Actually my fractured foot was not from playing tennis, it was the fault of an incorrect medicine dosage which caused a fall. The knee problem was quickly resolved with fascia rolling. Have had very little injuries related to tennis actually during my long tennis playing. Appreciate your advice on not overdoing it with serve practice. You sound a lot like my wife who tries to slow me down... guess I tend to have the “18 until I die” syndrom of Bryan Adams...

Well at least I knew you well enough to write what I did with a disclaimer..."not necessarily to you personally". I personally created a problem in my shoulder shortly before I resigned from my position at my club here in Sweden. I did it with over enthusiastic serving with too little warmup. The result is pain with every motion that is above my shoulder. Fortunately it doesn't seem to bother me with the golf swing...which is mostly taking place below the shoulder. It doesn't bother shovelling horse poop either. I don't anticipate it bothering me shovelling snow either. But I don't see myself serving too much in the future.

Shoulders are rather complicated and I stand behind my advice to be careful. After a certain age we aren't not so resilient. That being said...I am not necessarily saying it to you. Perhaps ferli001 will find it wise to proceed with a certain amount of caution...and intelligence. Who knows somebody else might listen to my advice. Even a guy like klacr. Warm up properly. Preparation is the mantra of a tennis player...or golfer.

But personally I am pulling for you. I hope that you find what you are looking for and if I can help you let me know. Godspeed!

[gzhpcu]

Thanks don_budge. Actually my fractured foot was not from playing tennis, it was the fault of an incorrect medicine dosage which caused a fall. The knee problem was quickly resolved with fascia rolling. Have had very little injuries related to tennis actually during my long tennis playing. Appreciate your advice on not overdoing it with serve practice. You sound a lot like my wife who tries to slow me down... guess I tend to have the “18 until I die” syndrom of Bryan Adams...

[don_budge]

From the Range, to Practicing on the Course, to Playing on the Course...to the End Game. Competition.

Fer1001, I am taking one hour a week where I only hit serves. 3 times a week I play matches.

Phil...this is not necessarily to you personally. I know how you work and to say that you are stubborn is an understatement. I know this about you as I know myself and I struggle to find the balance between being obstinate and being determined in a constructive way.

But here goes...at Phil's age there would be one thing that concerns me over and above the quest for the perfect service motion. That would be avoiding injury. But once again...I pretend like I "know" Phil. Phil is not only stubborn, he is very thorough. So I am pretty certain from his past posts that he has a really good "prehabilitation" program that is designed to prevent injuries before they happen. But that being said he does reveal that he gets some pretty serious injuries at times and then has to spend time rehabilitating. This is unfortunately time wasted but it happens.

An hour of serving is a lot of wear and tear on the shoulder. You must exercise a lot of caution with the shoulder because one false move and you are fucked. Shoulders are not easily rehabilitated in many cases and when you are older this becomes more the case than not.

So I would recommend to someone in Phil's position (not necessarily Phil because he is very stubborn and I know this) that you have a very specific routine with your service practice. Use targets at points in the service court that you want to hit in your matches and practice four serves in a row at a target. As you move across the tennis court from your left to right aiming at the specific targets you educate your body to adjust to aiming. If you have six targets and hit four balls at each target you might repeat this two or three times every day if you can. This results in hitting 50 to 75 serves a day which is plenty. In most cases too much.

Start slowly and concentrate on the motion creating the power and not you "muscling" the ball. Swing the racquet head at the target and try to avoid making the muscles that create tension in the wrist and forearm that inhibit the ability for free flowing movement.

Hi Phil, how are you balancing playing matches with rebuilding and practicing your serve motion? I decided not to play any competitive matches this summer in the hope of getting enough of a change to my motion before league play... but now it seems that one summer may not be enough...

Ahhh...typical golfer. The golfer has to learn how much time to spend on the range and then to take it to the court. Face the devil so to speak. So ferli001 I recommend the daily regime that I didn't necessarily prescribe for Phil above. For you, depending upon other factors, fifteen minutes a day is plenty of time to practice the serve and then spend much of your time actually playing practice sets. Some drilling and some "hitting a few" with practice parters as well. HIT AGAINST THE WALL!!!

As I try to recover my golf game I focus on specifics and practice until I get some feel for what I am looking for. Then I might practice on to try and reinforce it a bit. But as you know what is learned today is easily forgotten tomorrow. Keep a journal.

By focusing too much on the service motion you might inadvertently be reinforcing bad motions. Then you have created a "poor groove" from which to serve from. Now you will have to backtrack in order to go forwards. Trust me...and the fifteen minutes a day concentrating on specific parts of the whole and you stroke will evolve. It will take time. Rome wasn't built in a day...you know.

Golf practice should be very target oriented. You cannot just go to the range and hit willy nilly all over the place. You have to work on your set up and ball positioning as you mentioned in your pre-shot routine. So we must learn to practice on the range as we might be hitting shots on the course.

Funny that you talk about the avoiding of matches in lieu of concentrating on developing a serve. I have the same sort of issue. I will go to the course and practice for a very long time and then I am too tired to play. But I have to go and face the devil now and get out on the course and start to build the mental case for being there. I have started slowly now and gone out and played four holes a couple of times. I will start to build on this.

As a golfer you know that the longest walk is from the range to the first tee (Moe Norman) and as a tennis player get in there and mix it up while devoting part of your day to contemplating your technique. You cannot become overly technique conscious in tennis and once you get used to "playing" this is the real joy of the game. Just as in golf.

Above all...do not injure that shoulder!

[gzhpcu]

Fer1001, I am taking one hour a week where I only hit serves. 3 times a week I play matches.

[ferli001]

Hi Phil, how are you balancing playing matches with rebuilding and practicing your serve motion? I decided not to play any competitive matches this summer in the hope of getting enough of a change to my motion before league play... but now it seems that one summer may not be enough...